Episode 1045 - Undervalued Self Defense Skills

In this episode join Jeremy and Andrew as they discuss the most undervalued self defense skills.

Undervalued Self Defense Skills - Episode 1045

SUMMARY

In this episode, Jeremy Lesniak and Andrew Adams discuss undervalued self-defense skills, emphasizing the importance of de-escalation, awareness, and risk mitigation. They explore how traditional self-defense training often overlooks these critical skills, focusing instead on physical techniques.

The conversation highlights the need for martial arts schools to incorporate soft skills into their curriculum to better prepare students for real-life situations. The hosts share personal anecdotes and insights on how to assess and evaluate potentially dangerous situations, ultimately advocating for a more holistic approach to self-defense training.

TAKEAWAYS

• Self-defense is more than just physical techniques.

• De-escalation is a crucial skill that can be learned.

• Awareness of surroundings can mitigate risks.

• Soft skills are often overlooked in self-defense training.

• It's important to assess situations before they escalate.

• Nobody wins a fight; prevention is key.

• You can influence situations but not control others' actions.

• Teaching self-defense should include communication skills.

• Martial arts schools should incorporate soft skills into their curriculum.

CHAPTERS

00:00 Introduction to Self-Defense Skills
02:01 The Importance of De-Escalation
06:33 Awareness and Risk Mitigation
10:54 Assessment and Evaluation of Situations
25:27 Conclusion and Key Takeaways

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After listening to the episode, it would be exciting for us to know your thoughts about it. Don’t forget to drop them in the comment section down below!

SHOW TRANSCRIPT

Jeremy Lesniak (02:09.934)

What's happening everybody? Welcome back. It's another episode of Whistlekick Martial Arts Radio. I'm Jeremy Lesniak joined by my great friend Andrew Adams. Andrew, how are you today?

Andrew Adams (02:19.92)

I'm great. was enjoying your introduction there. You're like martial arts radio. Like it was very radio voice. Yeah, I dig it.

Jeremy Lesniak (02:25.198)

I was doing all the different voices. I started to do like, I was thinking about doing the after dark, but that one often sounds inappropriate. I wasn't gonna stay there. then you, surprise. And then you've got like the drive time DJ who's just really excited about everything. Everything's gonna be great. And on today's episode, you're gonna experience.

Andrew Adams (02:33.584)

yeah, yeah, I do a really good one of those.

Andrew Adams (02:47.686)

Yeah.

Jeremy Lesniak (02:48.598)

you're going to experience Andrew and I talking. And, you know, we don't we don't bring a gimmicks. We just bring you good stuff. Today's episode, we're going to talk about the undervalued skills that are related to self-defense. Quite often, self-defense is compartmentalized as punching and kicking and grappling and weapons and running away. But there's so much and I would argue and I'm going to guess Andrew's going to agree with me that there's so much more in that mix and it is actually

the larger stuff to consider and it is there's more of it and there's and it's more important. There we go. That's what I was looking for. So what do we mean by that? Well, you stick around and you find out. Today's episode is brought to you by Marshalllytics. I believe and I went and found Marshalllytics and started using it and then they started sponsoring us. So I believe Marshalllytics is the best option for running your martial arts school. It is wonderfully affordable. It is effective. It works. It's simple. They have great support.

And if you go through whistlekickmarshallartsradio.com, go to the top, you'll see a section up there for our sponsors, and you sign up for a free trial, you let them know that you came through us, you're gonna get two months of free trial, not just one. That's a pretty good deal. And if you want some hand holding, let me know somebody on our team, somebody at Whistlekick will help you get started because we believe that strongly in it.

What else should we tell them? Sign up for the email newsletter so you get every episode emailed to you along with bonuses and you can find that also at whistlekickmercialartsradio.com.

think that's it for right now. Let's talk about it, Andrew. Well, yeah, what else we got?

Andrew Adams (04:25.298)

I would say also, if you're watching this on YouTube, hit that like and subscribe button, hit that notification bell. I've said this on some of our Thursday episodes. You may not have heard them yet, Jeremy, but it's weird. I don't understand the algorithm. I don't even know what an algorithm is. I'm kidding. I do. YouTube likes that. They like to see the people are engaging with our stuff. So even if you're listening to this in your car, maybe pull your car over. Don't do this while you're driving. Pull your car over. Stop.

Jeremy Lesniak (04:31.748)

Yeah. Yeah.

Andrew Adams (04:56.326)

Go to YouTube, like and subscribe this episode and hit notification and then you can keep driving. Thank you. That would mean a lot.

Jeremy Lesniak (05:04.066)

There's a lot, you know, we haven't said this in a while. I'm gonna say it real quick. There are a lot of things you can do to help us. You can show up to events, you can buy things. You can also do lots of things that are completely free. You can subscribe, notifications, follow us on our various social channels. You can leave reviews on Facebook, Apple podcasts, Google. Any of those things would be really helpful. yeah, yeah, there's a million and one things you can do. Alrighty.

Andrew Adams (05:26.138)

You can share an episode with a friend.

Andrew Adams (05:31.922)

All right.

Jeremy Lesniak (05:33.406)

So, self defense. We set this up at the top.

Andrew Adams (05:36.528)

Yeah. So yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jeremy Lesniak (05:40.245)

Most people talk about self defenses, you know, if this thing, then you do this punch, you do this kick or you work this concept or you pull your knife or you run away. And it just it feels like such an incomplete conversation. It feel it feels. It feels like watching us highlight reel from a sports game from a baseball game. The game was nine innings.

and we're watching this 30 seconds. And I feel like a self-defense situation is also like that, the way we talk about it in this industry.

Andrew Adams (06:20.986)

Yeah, I think so. I think if you're going to break down self-defense skills, putting those in air quotes skills, we, again, in air quotes, we, people who teach that often look at the punching and kicking and learning how to quote, defend yourself as starting when someone attacks you and

We know, you and I know, and a lot of our listeners probably do as well, that there are a lot of things you can do before that happens. And those are skills should be learned. And people often call those the soft skills, right?

Jeremy Lesniak (07:04.91)

I want to because I think this is an important distinction. I'm going to reframe a little bit of what you said and I hope this is okay. It's not that there are a lot of things that you could do or that you could. There are things that happen regardless whether you engage with them and have awareness of them or not. And I think the reason I'm making that distinction is because the way you said it could lead people to believe that it's a choice.

Andrew Adams (07:22.556)

Sure, sure.

Andrew Adams (07:32.818)

fair. It can be.

Jeremy Lesniak (07:34.112)

That if you don't look for it, it's not there, it's there, whether or not you look for it. Whether or not you are choosing to apply knowledge, these skills that we're talking about, to that portion of the situation, you are engaging with it.

Andrew Adams (07:48.816)

Yep. Yep. So a perfect example is just de-escalation, just talking, right? That is a skill that you can learn and you can work towards make, you can utilize that before someone attacks you. Now, not, not always someone might jump out of the woods and you might not have an opportunity, but we often call those types of skills, the quote soft skills. And I would say, and I did not come up with this. This is not, this is not off the dome and I just had an epiphany.

I was listening to the conversations on karate podcast. and this was from a number of months ago and they had on, two guests, Richard Demetri and Pamela Armitage were the two guests and they were talking about this thing. And, and what they said was essentially soft skills are the hardest to learn, which makes sense. Absolutely.

But we often, martial arts instructors and self people teach self-defense often only focus on essentially the quote easy things, the learning how to punch and kick, which everybody can do. And they all forget about running scenarios on how to talk your way out of situations or other ways of extricating yourself from a situation. Those soft skills are really valuable.

Jeremy Lesniak (09:12.96)

Yeah, you're mentioning another podcast that we both think very well of and for those of you out there if you really enjoy martial arts content make sure you're checking out their show they do a great show. There are two problems with de-escalation. One, it's less sexy than how to punch, kick, grapple. So if you have a choice of teaching these things

Andrew Adams (09:31.045)

Absolutely.

Jeremy Lesniak (09:38.027)

Okay, we're gonna spend an hour going over de-escalation. I'll see you later, right? Like it's not something that most people wanna spend the time on, which is ironic. And I think part of what makes it ironic is because for so many of us, self-defense is not the primary reason we're training. For a lot of us, we enjoy the physical side of things. We need more physical things in our life. So we appreciate the physical aspects of self-defense. And I think the second reason,

is that to properly de-escalate requires a suspension of ego. It requires a huge amount of humility. And unfortunately, we go back in time and we can see even from the early days of traditional martial arts training in the West, there has always been a strong component of, well, how do I know if this stuff works?

And so you would have people, unfortunately, we've heard some of this on this show, I don't condone this, but people going out to, let's say a bar, it's always the quintessential environment, and not deescalating, so I have an opportunity to pry out my physical skills.

Jeremy Lesniak (10:53.459)

People ask me People who don't train ask me Have you ever been in a fight does this work in a fight? How would you be you know if that person and and I tell people point-blank if you're looking for Someone to teach you how to win a fight. I am NOT your best choice Because I've managed to de-escalate Every fight I've ever been in since fourth grade. I had one in fourth grade I did win but it was fourth grade. So does that even really matter?

Andrew Adams (11:11.088)

Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Lesniak (11:24.302)

But if you want to learn how to avoid the fight, if you want to learn to deescalate the fight, I have a fantastic choice on how to teach that. And every single time a situation presents, because it's not like they don't present. I've had plenty of opportunities. I'm using air quotes. I'm borrowing your device, Andrew. I'm using air quotes. Lots of opportunities to get into fights over the years from high school on up. And every single time the adrenaline comes up,

and I have to put it aside. I have to fight that primal part of myself that says, all right, let's go, especially because I have confidence in my physical skills.

Because de-escalation isn't always, hey, let's not fight, fighting's bad, no one wins. I've done an entire episode on the progression that I use in de-escalation, and they all require compromising your ego. Everything from pretending you're insane to...

Suggesting that that person attacking you and this works better for me as a smaller man What does it really get you to beat up a guy who's five-seven? Right, it's all ego suspension and In order to suspend your ego you have to be confident in who you are and so this to me comes full circle as

until you're able to fully embrace de-escalation, you have not gained the most important lessons that martial arts can bring you.

Andrew Adams (13:08.082)

Yeah, that's a really good point. And I think the not sexy part of it is, you know, I think that's a major reason why it's not often taught because it's not quote fun to do. But I think if you are a school that, and this is my opinion, and I'm not going to go so far as to say this is your opinion, Jeremy.

I'm not going to go so far as to say this is Whistlekick's opinion. This is Andrew Adams' opinion. But if you are a school that says you teach self-defense, if you use that in your marketing and in your advertising, you really need to be focusing on these types of skills. What does that mean? Maybe run some scenarios where in class you are talking and you having someone pretend to be a drunk person that

is upset at you because you are looking at the door when their girlfriend is just happens to be in the way and it looks like you're looking at his girl or whoever like those types of scenarios need to be taught. Now, if you're not, if your martial arts school doesn't say we're we're teaching self-defense, like, okay, whatever. But I really strongly feel if you are saying to the public, we are going to teach you how to defend yourself. If you get into a fight,

You need to start that before you actually get into a fight. That's my opinion.

Jeremy Lesniak (14:33.878)

I will go, I do agree with you, Andrew. I think it is absolutely critical. And I will go almost a step farther to say every single time I have taught this sort of material, because there's a seminar that I run on self-defense and it is very different from what most people do. And this is three quarters of it.

Jeremy Lesniak (14:57.198)

There are always always people in the in the seminar that will tell me This is not what I expected I am so thankful you did it in this way The number of people that you have that come to you if you're if you're a school We assume you're all martial artists. We don't assume you're all martial arts schools school owners or instructors The number of people that come into a school

that want some aspect of self-defense in there. It's pretty high, right? Otherwise there are plenty of other physical movement things you're gonna go to. The thing you can teach them the soonest that dramatically changes their safety is de-escalation. It is not punching and kicking or grappling or how to run away or how to poke somebody's eyeball out.

It's how to start talking themselves out of problems.

Andrew Adams (15:56.914)

And I do think that those are the harder skills to actually learn how to do. It's a lot harder, I think, to learn how to de-escalate a situation. And I think it's harder for multiple reasons. One is you're right, you have to get rid of your ego and be okay with like letting and again, air quotes, letting the other guy win because you're just going to walk away. But learning how to do that is difficult.

Learning how to, someone grabs your wrist and you do this technique. That's actually not hard to do. You know, anybody can learn how to do that. Learning how to deescalate is, I think, much harder.

Jeremy Lesniak (16:40.024)

Let's move on from de-escalation. De-escalation was first, because it's probably the most obvious, it's the most important one. It's the one that says, hey, it could be violent, but let's take it non-violent. But we talked about this being a wider time domain than simply the altercation. So when I move earlier on, the thing that I'm thinking about is awareness.

Andrew Adams (16:45.468)

Yep.

Andrew Adams (16:53.35)

Yep. Yep.

Andrew Adams (17:00.914)

That's where I was going to go next as well.

Jeremy Lesniak (17:04.482)

When you see the problem coming, whether that's the situation or the person or your actions and how they're contributing to the potential altercation, it gives you options. Now, they're not always great options. They might not change the time that you have much, but the better you get at it, the more likely it does.

So here's what we're talking about. We're talking about something like I'm walking down the street and I happen to notice that there is a person who's acting a little shifty as they look at me and they're fidgeting their hands in their pockets, but they're a hundred feet away and there's a group of people walking the other way. I've now seen that I recognize.

There's nobody else between me and them. There's no great opportunities for me to get out of the way. The other side of the sidewalk seems a little busier. I think I'm going to duck in with this group, go back to the crosswalk, press the light, move to the other side of the street.

Andrew Adams (18:17.67)

Yep. Here's another example that I have used that has absolutely come up. Driving my car, pull into the parking lot and there's a space right weight. Like, it's like I call the head to get premium print or as, my, as my wife often calls it princess parking.

Jeremy Lesniak (18:35.913)

I call it rockstar parking.

Andrew Adams (18:38.004)

yeah, which for me would be appropriate because I'm in a rock band now. But so I pull in the parking lot and there's a perfect spot. But there's two gentlemen arguing loudly, yelling at each other. And when I was on the street, I didn't see it. But I turned into the parking lot and they're right there, right where I was going to park. I mean, I could have still parked there. They were they weren't standing in my spot. Right. I say my spot. But they were close to it. And I said, you know what? I don't want to park there.

Jeremy Lesniak (19:01.134)

near it.

Andrew Adams (19:06.552)

I'm going to choose to go around to the other side because the parking lot was kind of a you and I'm going to park over there and I made a choice to not have to be anywhere in range of these people and where I wanted to go, I could go, I could walk past them or I could go the long way. You know what? I didn't want to be anywhere near what they were doing and I walked around the long way.

So, yep.

Jeremy Lesniak (19:34.319)

but you had nothing to gain, right? And so this is where I think awareness, the challenge with awareness is that when you observe things, people tend to go into one of two, I guess it's really, they have one typical response that dilutes out their awareness, which is, yeah, but I doubt anything's gonna happen.

They go into a statistical mode. They go into likely. It's not gonna happen. What are the chances? I'd actually rather people say, it'll never happen to me, but more often what I hear is, yeah, but what's the chance that's gonna happen? If the chance is not zero, so if we take your scenario, you're pulling up to this parking space. The chance of you parking in that space and...

Andrew Adams (20:04.4)

It'll never happen to me. It'll never happen to me.

Jeremy Lesniak (20:29.934)

maybe disrupting whatever was going on in such a way that one of those people is going to want to commit violence against you. It's not 100%. It's pretty small. 1%, 2%. How many of those 2 % things happen across weeks, months, and years of your life? A lot of them. You get a lot of them.

Andrew Adams (20:39.386)

Or my car. Yeah.

Andrew Adams (20:55.569)

Yep. Yep.

Jeremy Lesniak (20:57.9)

How many times do you want to roll that die?

Andrew Adams (21:00.922)

I didn't want to roll that die.

Jeremy Lesniak (21:06.67)

So you parked in a different space, you walked to wherever you were going in a slightly different path, you mitigated your risk. And I think that that is the important word. It's a word that we don't talk about often enough in self-defense, it's mitigation. How do we take the risk and make it smaller? I don't care how small it is to start with, it should be smaller. This is why if I'm going to certain places, I don't wear flip-flops, I wear sneakers.

This is why when I go to certain places, I make sure I wear a belt. We've talked about a belt is a great weapon. This is why if certain friends are going to certain places, I don't go because they are likely to stir up trouble. it's this environment on this day with this person, alcohol is involved. I didn't sleep well last night. Nope, I'm out.

Jeremy Lesniak (22:01.742)

I don't need to tell my friends why I'm doing that.

Jeremy Lesniak (22:10.676)

you know, I didn't take that spot by the door because I, I just felt like stretching my legs a little bit. My hips being a little wonky, I figured I'd stretch it out as I walked from the end of the parking lot. You know, no big deal.

Andrew Adams (22:21.362)

I mean, I actually in that scenario, if I had had someone in the car with me, I would have absolutely told them why. I would have said like,

Jeremy Lesniak (22:31.724)

Right. And there's nothing wrong with that. But the reason I bring that up is because for a lot of us, we have people around us who the moment we go into those modes, you we go into defense mode, martial arts mode, it becomes a point of contention. And so I bring that up because I mean, your wife very much supports you in that.

Andrew Adams (22:48.956)

Hmm. Yeah.

Jeremy Lesniak (22:54.54)

the people in my life, if they do, I've had people in my life who do not support this and I've told them point blank, this is a condition of spending time with me.

Andrew Adams (23:03.056)

Yeah, yeah. I just don't, guess I don't have many people in my life that wouldn't support that. Like, you know, my wife knows when we go out to eat, she will not, she will sit down first often, but she will always make sure that my, that I am facing the door.

Jeremy Lesniak (23:20.074)

You get that spot, absolutely, and I'm the same way. And so I'm bringing it up. No shame if you have people in your family and your life that aren't as supportive in this way. You don't have to justify things to them. You can find ways to explain it away. So we've got de-escalation. We've got awareness. And we've talked on the show quite a bit about awareness. There are ways you can train awareness. We're not going to get further into that.

Andrew Adams (23:27.398)

Yep.

Jeremy Lesniak (23:48.729)

But I think the next one, when we go even further out in time, is assessment. Considering what is the likelihood that based on everything I know and the actions I'm going to take, there might be a problem. So we just talked about it, right?

Okay, if I'm going there on this day to this place, alcohol is involved, so and so is going to be there, and I'm tired, and, and, and, I don't like the way these all stack up. Now, you might look at that and say, but Jeremy, what's the point? Well,

You probably know certain people that when they're part of a group, that group is more likely to get into trouble. I mean, it's violent trouble, but they're more likely to get into some manner of trouble. Sometimes it's fun trouble. Sometimes you like hanging out with that person who gets you into fun trouble. But the fact that you can recognize that difference, that's what I'm talking about with assessment. There are certain places that I will go on St. Patrick's Day.

Most of them I will not. If you're not from New England, you might not understand. It's almost a license to get into a fight in New England. I don't do that.

Jeremy Lesniak (25:09.703)

I grew up, well, longer story, there are certain sports teams, hats, that I will not wear in certain areas.

Jeremy Lesniak (25:25.24)

Jeremy, what's that gonna do? It was not that long ago that a man wearing a Yankees hat was run over in New Hampshire by a woman who was a Red Sox fan. He died. Is there more to the story? Of course there is, but that's what started it.

Andrew Adams (25:42.428)

Yep, yep, absolutely.

Jeremy Lesniak (25:43.466)

I don't look for problems, right? I perform this assessment. Andrew, I'm sure you do the same thing. You've got a kid in the house.

Andrew Adams (25:50.186)

absolutely. Absolutely. I do have a funny story about that, that exact sports team thing. The first time I went to Scotland, I saw a sign in a window of a bar that said no colors allowed. And in my head, I'm thinking no colors allowed.

they don't allow non-white people in it? Yeah, no joke. That's really what I thought. And what they mean was you're not allowed to wear your sports team things because there's such a rivalry.

Jeremy Lesniak (26:22.186)

You thought it was the 1950s.

Jeremy Lesniak (26:33.26)

because soccer rivalries, football rivalries are such a big deal over there. Yeah. Yeah. We don't have as much of that in the U.S. as some other countries do. But I I'm aware enough that I'm pretty sure I can make this statement. I believe I've heard this. If I was a fan, I would probably not be wearing Manchester United colors most places in the UK.

Andrew Adams (27:00.934)

Yep. Yep.

Jeremy Lesniak (27:01.742)

from what I understand they're pretty hated right and soccer fans football like you know non-American football fans are crazy.

Andrew Adams (27:09.562)

Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, that was interesting. Like there are pubs over there that you can't even, you're not even allowed to wear it. And the big rivalry would be the Glasgow Rangers and Celtic team. Rangers and Celtic, they like, so yeah. Yeah. But, in answer to question, yes, I do those things as well. I do those things as well.

Jeremy Lesniak (27:12.909)

Yeah.

Jeremy Lesniak (27:29.304)

So yeah.

Jeremy Lesniak (27:34.937)

So we've got, we've expanded the timetable. We've got assessment, we've got awareness, we've got de-escalation, and then we've got the situation. What's on the other side of the situation? I'm gonna call it debrief or, there's another word I'm missing that I like better for it. Evaluation, we can call it something like that.

Andrew Adams (27:41.989)

Awareness.

Jeremy Lesniak (28:03.116)

where you look at the situation and you look back through everything that happened from assessment through de-escalation and you learn from it. How do you make it better?

Jeremy Lesniak (28:16.974)

And it depends on what your goal is. Hopefully your goal is not to commit the successful violent act, but rather to prevent the violence in the first place. We've said it on this show. know Andrew and I are on the same page about this. Nobody wins a fight. The only way anybody wins a fight is if you're able to stop it from happening.

So that's when I get even close, I go back through and I'm like, okay, did I miss something? Did I miss something? Did I miss a cue? Did I miss a signal? Was there something where that person got upset and I could have handled it differently? Because I can't control what they do. I can influence, but I can only control what I do. And those are the things that I look for in that situation.

Andrew Adams (29:03.674)

Yep. Yep. I would agree wholeheartedly.

Jeremy Lesniak (29:08.538)

I don't know, you're probably not like me on this. You tend to let things go better than I do. I'll sit and I will reevaluate for weeks.

Andrew Adams (29:17.522)

Hmm.

Jeremy Lesniak (29:19.99)

I become, and it's not always healthy, and I'm the first one to admit that, I become minor, slightly obsessive over this, which I think has benefits as it relates to the skills themselves, but when it comes to my own mental and emotional health, no, it's not a healthy thing.

Andrew Adams (29:40.626)

Yeah, yeah, you are correct. tend I do tend to be able to just let things go and be over it. So yeah, I get it. Everyone. Everyone is different in that regard.

Jeremy Lesniak (29:52.322)

Are there any that we're missing here?

Andrew Adams (29:54.138)

No, those are the big things that I wanted to bring up. I mean, the biggest for me is that these skills are the hardest to teach. And I think they are the ones that are the least taught, period. And that I think if not everyone listening will be someone that runs their school, but you all train. So think about these things. And if you are a school owner and you do some teaching, think about teaching these skills.

Jeremy Lesniak (30:22.442)

you aren't a school owner, don't be afraid to ask your instructor and say, hey, you know, was thinking about this and you give us these tools. What about beforehand? What about after? You know, I think I think there are plenty of things that come to play around legal issues that we've talked about on this show, medical issues that we've talked about on this show. And I'm going to call.

I'm gonna call both of those, least in this context, those are at least firmer skills. These aren't quite the sort of skills that we wanted to talk about today. But remember, you're the one that guides your training. Yeah, you show up to class, but you choose to show up to class. You choose what you practice at home. You choose to listen or watch this show. You choose what books you read. You have a lot more say in the information you're taking in and how it becomes part of your martial arts.

then may realize. And if this seems important to you, then the first thing that I would recommend you do is go back and listen to it watch this episode a second time. See what other information to pull out from it. And then second, we've got other episodes on self-defense. Check them out.

Andrew Adams (31:25.17)

Mm.

Andrew Adams (31:36.614)

I agree.

Jeremy Lesniak (31:38.127)

Alright, thank you all for spending some time with us. appreciate you. you're if you want to make sure you get every single episode, sign up for the newsletter. Go to Martial Arts, Whistlekick Martial Arts Radio dot com. Hit that link up at the top. Subscribe to the newsletter. We're going to shoot you every single one right in your inbox. We're available on Spotify and YouTube and in every podcast player you could imagine. We're all over the map.

And if you want to join us as we travel around the map or maybe you want to bring us out for a teacher training or any number of things, go to whistlekick.com. See all the stuff that we do. We'd love to bring some of that to your area. Don't be afraid to contact us. Jeremy at whistlekick.com and Andrew at whistlekick.com. Until next time, take it, Andrew. Smile and.

Andrew Adams (32:24.316)

Train hard.

and have a great day.

Jeremy Lesniak (32:28.056)

Have a great day.